The Most Important?

[Labrys]

I have an online friend (yes, another one) facing difficulties.  There are financial ramifications, but what is really bothering her is some ongoing love-life infidelity issues.

She asked me, some months back to 'magic' the situation and I did so; now whether I am 'good' or not, or it was her confidence in me mediating change, things did improve.  But the progress is being eroded.  My energy stores are low and under constant demand with my own life and duties.

So, when she again requested help, and in an obviously fired up state, I suggested she take it under her own hand.  I told her I would make appropriate suggestions.

Then I bit my tongue (fingers?) because she is an utter newbie.  And while I feel confident in my ability to tell her the whys, why-nots, and wherefores, I DO recognize I come at most things from a different place than most witches.  I am not religiously motivated or guided in magic for instance, I don't believe in the three fold rule or karma.  I am highly experimental.

So, as I begin with the what to do, what not-to-bloody-do list; from a more conventional point of view, what do those of you here think is MOST important to tell this beleaguered young mother and wife?  I want to dot my 'i's' and cross my 't's' so she can feel effective in her own life, but not make herself feel worse.

I'm not subtle.  I'm a sledge-hammer mumbling at the hearth with bottles of potions at my side type.  Anyone want to help me mellow the lesson?

[Jennie]

"Be careful what you ask for: you'll probably get it."

Never a bad piece of advice for a newbie.

Another:

"You are responsible for all of the consequences of your working, even if you didn't mean for it to turn out that way."


And one that plenty of people who don't practice magic seem to have trouble with:

"Coerced fidelity isn't love."

[Labrys]

"Coerced fidelity isn't love."

Well, see, I have an opinion about that.  Enforced love is certainly not love.  

But, sometimes (the case in point being one), when a committed married person puts it all at risk for an utterly inexplicable liaison; it begs the question----which is the "enchantment"?  The marriage or the affair?

It has occurred to me that perhaps only practitioners of magic are really capable of recognition OF magical use.  But I don't think that means other folks never unwittingly use magical arts.  Yes, I know this flies in the face of "she couldn't enchant her way out of a wet paper bag" logic.   But I've seen evidence to the contrary.  (Oh, this may get long....sorry)

I once had a friend, who while she did believe in magic, did not consider herself a witch.  She considered herself psychic and little else.  On the rare occasions she actually gave magic an intentional try, she had no success.  I feel this may be because of some repression/inhibition issues from her upbringing---witches being evil and all that tripe.

However, when this woman was looped on painkillers and wine, which she combined rather habitually, she was capable of shockingly effective psychic attacks which I certainly would describe as magically effective.  She was completely unaware of this behavior; and in spite of many self-deluding issues, she would have been shocked by her behavior if confronted with it in sober state.

In this particular case, I think the 'other woman' may be similarly unwittingly enchanting.  The wife has done all sorts of mundane things to 'save' her marriage; addressing what she views as her own flaws and faults.  The husband even reaffirmed his love and commitment to her.  But then, he was discovered with the paramour again, evidently ashamed, but there.  

The other woman is, to all appearances, not the sort of person he likes, much less loves enough to risk all for---including familial condemnation.  And sure, plenty of ordinary psychological explanations could cover his behavior as well.  But, even it that is all it is; I think the wife has the right to pull whatever bunnies are necessary out of the hat to keep her young baby's father from taking a powder.

I'd magically "enforce" a LOT of things for the protection of my children.

[Jennie]

I'd still stand by the idea that coerced fidelity is not love, and anyone who considers binding a spouse or lover should think carefully about how this will permanently alter the nature of the relationship.

If unwanted magical interference in the marriage is suspected, I would think that the safer remedy would be wards of protection and possibly reflection of magical energy around the couple and especially around the suspected victim, not binding the spouse.

[Labrys]

If unwanted magical interference in the marriage is suspected, I would think that the safer remedy would be wards of protection and possibly reflection of magical energy around the couple and especially around the suspected victim, not binding the spouse.

Nobody said anything about magically binding the spouse.  But in instances of a young mother and infant being deserted by a philandering nitwit?  Hey, for some stability to better their lives with the time that some magical "interference" could provide seems a good trade off.  An enforced faithfulness may not be love, but it can be enough for a while to have a roof and meals until other options can be explored.

Ethics that do not serve the weakest and neediest in a situation and allow the blissful escape of the guilty scarcely seem worth the title to me.

[Jennie]

I think I should make it clear that my cautions regarding binding and coercion have at their root concern for the wronged parties in this matter. This wife and child deserve to have material security, love, and emotional support in their lives. If Philandering Nitwit is not the victim of magical interference, I really couldn't care less if they get this through him being hit by a truck, collecting the insurance money, and finding a nice man they can both love who falls in love with them on their way to the funeral.

But I think your friend deserves to be able to take joy and comfort when her husband says "I love you," instead of wondering if it is only the effect of a magical working. She deserves to be able to watch her child smile at Daddy and know that the return smile is real. The deep doubt and resentment in the relationship that binding workings can generate in the person doing the work are the reasons that I would counsel her to try alternate methods to make sure that she gets the things she needs.

Certainly, in my opinion, she should do work mudanely and magically to ensure the she and her child are protected and are financially secure. Those workings don't have to include anything about binding how Philandering Nitwit behaves, only about being protected from how his behavior might otherwise impact her and her child.

[Labrys]

That is rather the point, you see.  She doesn't care if he says he loves her....she finds that pretty unbelievable at this point anyway.  But she NEEDS him to stay at the moment and spend his time on HIS family until she can secure them in other ways.

There is no insurance, they are facing bankruptcy and all security is fragile.  And made more so by his continual need to escape to other arms where he doesn't have to feel responsible and adult.

Before any faith in the relationship can be repaired, he must quit spending nights in another bed.  Period, by whichever means makes it so.   

[Lark]

It is not uncommon for individuals (not just men) to try to run away when they are caught in stressful situations that they cannot seem to find their way out of.  As you say, this couple are in serious financial difficulties and in danger of bankruptcy.  I take it from this that he is at least under-employed and unable to find employment that gives them a living wage.  So the husband may be feeling less of a man because he is unable to take care of his family as he believes he ought to be doing.  So he runs away for a short time to a place where the stress isn't there anymore.  In his case it is infidelity...it could as easily have been alcohol or drugs or some other form of escape.  He could also have chosen to simply abandon them.  That he seems remorseful and hasn't left them in the lurch is actually a favorable sign.

What you might consider instead of coercive magic is some form of workings to help them resolve their financial situation and relieve the strain on the family that is driving him to find some form of escape with another woman.  If you can relieve the stress caused by the financial situation the other problem should resolve itself.  If it doesn't then there are of course other means to achieve that end.

If what you're really needing, as your one post suggested, is that the young wife and child have food and shelter while exploring other options then finding ways of achieving that rather than looking at ways to make hubby stay home.  By looking only at one solution as providing this goal you may be closing your eyes to a variety of other possibilities both magical and mundane.

[Labrys]

It is not uncommon for individuals (not just men) to try to run away when they are caught in stressful situations that they cannot seem to find their way out of.  As you say, this couple are in serious financial difficulties and in danger of bankruptcy.  I take it from this that he is at least under-employed and unable to find employment that gives them a living wage.

So far as I know, he does have a decent job, but made some bad financial choices.

  So the husband may be feeling less of a man because he is unable to take care of his family as he believes he ought to be doing.  So he runs away for a short time to a place where the stress isn't there anymore.  In his case it is infidelity...it could as easily have been alcohol or drugs or some other form of escape. 

At first, the wife and I both thought it was stress and feelings of failure.  Alas, time revealed that the affair began DURING her pregnancy (I know, also not uncommon) and this was crushing to her.  She has extremely difficult pregnancies...this is her first live-birth after multiple miscarriages and her husband complained the entire time that she was 'not doing her job.'  Empathy-free bastard, he is.

He could also have chosen to simply abandon them.  That he seems remorseful and hasn't left them in the lurch is actually a favorable sign.

If only.  He has a large and very traditional family breathing down his neck.  They love his wife and the new grandchild.  I think that is the only thing holding him in check.  And the fact that his financial difficulties mean he can't afford rent elsewhere.  The paramour apparently doesn't want him full time in her home.

What you might consider instead of coercive magic is some form of workings to help them resolve their financial situation and relieve the strain on the family that is driving him to find some form of escape with another woman.  If you can relieve the stress caused by the financial situation the other problem should resolve itself.  If it doesn't then there are of course other means to achieve that end.

Yes, that I have been working.  But re-discovering the husband skipping his first Father's Day ever to be with the lover....man, the poor wife about came unhinged.  I think she should simply divorce him and be done.  She found out, somewhat belatedly, that he did this BEFORE; he was married when he met her.  A fact she was not aware of until far too late.

If what you're really needing, as your one post suggested, is that the young wife and child have food and shelter while exploring other options then finding ways of achieving that rather than looking at ways to make hubby stay home.  By looking only at one solution as providing this goal you may be closing your eyes to a variety of other possibilities both magical and mundane.

I'm looking and seeing many choices, mostly, I am refusing to personally do more magic to hold onto this useless man FOR the woman still attached by love and parenthood.  I told her I will work for other things....her security and safety; but if she wants to hold him in a lasso magical or otherwise, that is her personal tasking.

I am frankly so aggravated at the man, I fear to do any magic related to him....

[Lark]

Yeah, with this other information you provided the guy sounds like just another selfish nitwit.  And I think any coercive magic to keep this relationship together is simply good energy thrown down the drain.  As you know, any magic has its time limits and eventually the same sort of behavior is apt to occur.

Better to help her work with positive magics to move on and create a stable life for herself and her child.  You said his family is supportive?  Where is HER family in all of this?

[Labrys]

Yeah, with this other information you provided the guy sounds like just another selfish nitwit.  And I think any coercive magic to keep this relationship together is simply good energy thrown down the drain.  As you know, any magic has its time limits and eventually the same sort of behavior is apt to occur.

Yeah, and I do think that is what happened.  He was all lovey-dovey for a while and then just slid away into the slimy self-gratification-habits again.  I have irons in enough fires that I can't waste any energy on this brand of futility.

Better to help her work with positive magics to move on and create a stable life for herself and her child.  You said his family is supportive?  Where is HER family in all of this?

I'm not sure.  I think her dad is dead, but I could be mis-remembering.  I am hoping her pleas for help, for angry repayment of her efforts with more philandering, is a sign that she is catching wise and gathering her defenses to make secure a life for herself and her daughter free of the idiot sperm donor.

I'm waiting for email reply to some questions and instructed her on some uber-grounding work to try to get some clarity apart from the smoke and fire of temper.

Tho' I admit, if she has a full head of steam, I dont' really care if she tosses a couple energetic magical grenades at the dimwit.  Or his two-faced paramour (her former 'dear' friend).